Hello all

[trumar]

Hi all,

First time poster. I'm not a fitter, but have been watching and learning form this valuable forum. I am about to embark on getting a new kitchen, and my wife and I are in the process of deciding on finishes etc. So we are a little way off pushing the button.

I have a couple of questions though, if I may.

I've read with interest about British vs German kitchens. The names 'Stormer' and 'true-handleless' are used to describe some German manufacturers, but are there some British manufacturers you could recommend? We don't want cheap, but we're don't want top shelf either. It seems Wren are to be avoided but are there others in a similar price range that are better quality or at least able to be recommended? Thanks. and then does that price the Germans out?

Next, we are in Wiltshire, just south of the M4. Are there some fitters I could be in contact with? Anyone could PM me. No problems.

Ok, thanks again.

[Claydon Lad]

Hi Trumar - and welcome to the forum. 

Personally I couldn't tell you much regarding the German Kitchens - Snezza is the one to ask, he's been fitting those since the dark ages ! ( sorry Snez  )

If you're looking for a decent British manufacturer with a true handleless - the type with the aluminium rails and the slightly shorter doors - we install Crown Imperial and have done for a number of years. It's quality is far better than your Wren, Magnet, etc etc and is very versitile when it comes to the sizes of units and doors that's required. 

Down in Wiltshire maybe a bit far for us from Bucks, but we could always supply you with one if you get stuck. 
We've found when fitting the handless stuff a few important tips that could save a lot of headaches when everything goes in. 

They are very nice kitchens out there, - but also a fair amount of over priced shite too !

[Daniel]

Welcome Trumar ..... straight in there with the bomb shell of a questions 

I would advise you now duck and cover as you have thrown the grenade and there's no putting the pin back now !!

I'm have no opinion to be honest, they are both as bad as each other 

[PJK]

Nice intro trumar. 

Welcome.

If your after true handleless the Cladden Lad is the way to go.

[trumar]

Nice intro trumar. 

Welcome.

If your after true handleless the Cladden Lad is the way to go.

Thanks very much PJK. I'll look into them, along with the other suggestions.

[trumar]

Hi Trumar - and welcome to the forum. 

Personally I couldn't tell you much regarding the German Kitchens - Snezza is the one to ask, he's been fitting those since the dark ages ! ( sorry Snez  )

If you're looking for a decent British manufacturer with a true handleless - the type with the aluminium rails and the slightly shorter doors - we install Crown Imperial and have done for a number of years. It's quality is far better than your Wren, Magnet, etc etc and is very versitile when it comes to the sizes of units and doors that's required. 

Down in Wiltshire maybe a bit far for us from Bucks, but we could always supply you with one if you get stuck. 
We've found when fitting the handless stuff a few important tips that could save a lot of headaches when everything goes in. 

They are very nice kitchens out there, - but also a fair amount of over priced shite too !

Thanks very much Claydon. I'll look into the Crown range. Ta. I might tackle Snezza via PM.

[PREM]

Welcome Trumar

Yes the german kitchens are better than british but not in a massive way. A bit like the cars we drive, the Merc is the best of the bunch. I have had a few of them and would like another as i judge every car i sit in against them.  They don't do anything different than everyone else, just a little better,  which has the price tag against it.

A good local independent or like CL says crown and a good fitter good fitter good fitter, have a guess whats the important part.

[trumar]

Welcome Trumar

Yes the german kitchens are better than british but not in a massive way. A bit like the cars we drive, the Merc is the best of the bunch. I have had a few of them and would like another as i judge every car i sit in against them.  They don't do anything different than everyone else, just a little better,  which has the price tag against it.

A good local independent or like CL says crown and a good fitter good fitter good fitter, have a guess whats the important part.

Great, thanks Prem. I'm looking at Crown now. Out of interest then, what's a comparable German? And are Alno good? How do they compare to the Stormers etc?

[Colour Republic]

Hi Trumar,

I suppose the first thing to point out is that kitchens, no matter their origin, are made to a price point that suits the market they are aiming them at. In fact you may be surprised to learn that many 'English' kitchens are in fact European made. The retailer is English, the units can come from Germany, the doors from Italy and the parent company be Swedish!

Just because something is English, German, Italian does't always mean one is better than the other.

For example Magent kitchens is an English retailer, but it has a Swedish parent company called Nobia. That parent company has many different brands which produces kitchens of varying quality. They have a brand called Rixonway which produces kitchens for budget housing, Magnet kitchens aimed at small builders, Gower Kitchens for DIY'ers (Wickes kitchens are Gower) all the way up to Pronorm which is recognised as a high end German kitchen, with a price tag to match.

Equally a kitchens origin doesn't make it cheap or expensive. You'll find many German kitchens are similar price or even cheaper than some English kitchens. So don't assume you can't afford a German kitchen.

It's about finding a brand which offers value for money in your price bracket, regardless of where it was made or came from.

I suppose the biggest 'general' difference between English and German kitchens, isn't price, it's that German kitchens tend to offer a lot more customisations as standard. The majority of English brands will have 40 different kitchens in their product range and that's it. They mass produce these kitchens and hold stock. A German brand may only have 12 different styles, but then allow you to finish each one in 100 different ways, so technically speaking they have a range of 1,200 different kitchens compared to the English offering of just 40. Of course having 1,200 different options makes it impossible to mass produce and hold stock, so all are made to order. That of course is a generalisation, you will find English brands which offer the same, but tend to be harder to find and in the upper end of the market when you do.

My advice would be to go and see some independent retailers in your area, you may be surprised that they aren't as expensive as you imagine, many will be similar prices to the big retailers, but offer a better product, giving you better value for money. Go and have a chat with them and if at all possible, be open about your budget. Give them a wish list and your budget and they will quickly tell you if they can help or not. There is no point in getting a design done for a £40k kitchen if you only have £8k to spend, equally you may find that kitchen you perceive to be £30k is in fact just £15k and within budget.

Good luck